Banner Help!

Hi Amanda, and welcome! Your design is very appealing, I never thought of a fox playing an accordion, before. And I like how you call it an amber not a red fox. Makes me wish I could see your shop, now!

I think I can help you with fitting this design into your banner, as long as it is proportional to the 790 x 150 banner space allowed. I use Photoshop and save it for the web at the exact size and resolution needed.

If you want to email me, I'll give it a try.

OMG Aline, you are just a doll. I love poppyswap people! Also, I am coming to Eugene at the end of the month! (and then headed to the Portland herb conference). 

Tea?

Hi Aline! Just got back late from a family gathering, so I'll give you a call in the morning! Thanks so much for the offer! I greatly appreciate it!

Pure sweetness!  Aline, you are a treasure!  Amber, I love your unique logo and your sweet online presence.  Good luck to you in your business endeavors!

p.s.  I read your recent blog post about self-love, and I absolutely plan on making use of your henna tips!!  Great info, thank you!

ah, dang! it's too long to fit! maybe you can go see it here... http://www.poppyswap.com/storecatalog.asp?userid=499

I love this conversation! Amanda, Kiki, Kristie and Gwendolyn, you all have given me so much to respond to...I'm excited and intimidated at the same time. I mean, I could easily talk about this topic at great length, but I find it not so easy to write about.

First, I want to thank Amanda for seeking help and for showing me by example that we can post images to the forum. I don't know why I assumed that this forum was text only, but you've changed that assumption! We can all see now that our images posted here have a limit on width...I figure this to be about 450 pixels wide, or roughly 6.25 inches. Looks like the height is not limited in this way? Anyway, I'm happy to know that this forum is open to visual communication, because this is my strength.

Second, I like how Amanda, used quotes in her other forum conversations this week to clarify...You said "that", I feel or think this. Directing her responses very clearly. So, I'm going to italize the pieces I want to respond to now, quoting you first, then giving my reply, like so;

having a hard time making my logo work for my banner. No matter what I do, and how I resize it, it's too big for the page.

This is where you started, and it points out the unique design challenges behind every logo design. A logo should work for the business in every application, without sacrificing quality or legibility, and provide name recognition for the business in words and in pictures. As to size, I ask myself not just how the logo will fit on a poppyswap store banner, but also, how will it look on a billboard, or storefront sign, a business card or product label. So, the whole process of creating a logo becomes quite complex. And 1 ounce tinctures have very small labels. I'll have to come back to this, later.

Aline! I just realized I know who you are! 

Amanda, I can't thank you enough for placing me in the real world...and your appreciation of my contributions. I was beginning to feel a need to integrate my online presence with my real life work. My mind seemed to be working in 2 realms, and I started to question my sanity? You tagged and grounded me here. Now, I get to tell you what I do outside of poppyswap, and what I've done.

I think for now, that we may have begun to work it out on our own (well, mostly my partner, as this kinda stuff is not my forte')

I applaud you and Justin for your self-reliance and persistence. Not your forte'? It is mine. Perhaps too much so! In my former career as a graphic designer, I created dozens of logos for dozens of clients in the Eugene area. This takes me back to 1978, a year after landing in Eugene, when I painted a cookie cart for Monster Cookie's street vendor and getting compensated thru a barter network we called Eugene Switchboard. I finished my fine art degree in visual comunications, earning a BFA in 1982. I freelanced up until 1998. Most of my designs served the needs of the natural products industry very well, and continue to do so. A need arose for me to integrate my new life on the land with my partner, and my work in the larger world, so together we created Green Journey Seeds.

I worked really hard telling my partner Justin what to do, and then he edited and re-edited it a bajillion times), so go easy, but be honest.

I honestly love your art, and I want to see it work for you. I don't see it working YET, so I must say why.  I hope you'll take this kindly, as I intend it?

1)The art we are discussing should be attributed to the artist in this and every other published version or editorial writing. Please do all artists a favor and name her/him.

2)This art should not be reproduced at a size which sacrifices any detail for the sake of size. In the small version, I want to see the whites of your fox's eyes, their steady gaze comforts me. I want to know that the poppies are poppies, and the accordian is just that. Your artist lovingly created all of this as a whole piece, every bit is essential to it's integrity and charm. Why lose any of it?

3) The intent of the whole banner is to identify your store by name. The main emphasis should be on the words "Amber Fox Apothecary". Justin's version has about equal emphasis on your name, illustration, motto, herb photos and yellow (blank) spaces. Don't be afraid to ask for another design which places your business name above all else in size, boldness, center stage! This is your store!

I'm reading all the advice being put out here by you guys, and want to really take it absorb it and hopefully come back with an even better end product.

 I applaud your method as you express it here, and this illustrates the value of this forum to all of us!

ah, dang! it's too long to fit!

Whew, I'm almost done! I often ask myself, just because it can be done this way, should it be done this way? Behind either/or choices, there lies a purpose. Which brings us back to your banner. What is your purpose? What is essential, and what is not?  Should we be trying to fit it in such a small space? I think not. Why not try some banner design without the fox, and show the fox within your storefront at a larger size? Most artwork, as a general rule of thumb, can survive a 50% reduction, without losing too much quality. Or go back to your artist and ask if they would mind you using a detail from the original (I'm thinking head, shoulders, poppies, top of the accordian, the musical ribbon,perhaps) in your banner? I'm placiing a 4 x4 inch window over the art in my mind's eye and see some potential for it. 4x4 at 50% is 2x2 which will fit in the banner height of 150 pixels (approx. 75 pixels to the inch) The remaining space (about 640 x 150) could accomodate your business name and motto nicely and give your business name greater emphasis.

Amanda, I'm hoping this will push you in a new direction, and one which will benefit you and your online your business. And I pray that I haven't given you more than you asked for!!!

Kiki, YES TEA Anytime!

Kristie, You've got the top prize for helping out a fellow swapper!  Welcome to my one time, wide-eyed, well-meaning Wednesday Art Workshop!

Gwendolyn, You are precious, too! So glad you are with us!

Whew, this was hard to put in words! Love, Aline

Wednesday again! Yes, this has been a heady week for us, too! Thanks so much for your reply, Amanda!

I checked out your latest banner design this morning. Much better! Main emphasis on your business name, and less on your "motto" creates a more balanced feel.

Thanks for naming the artist, Jenny Curtis. About further accrediting her work on your labels, since she has given you full permission to use the art for your business, this shouldn't be necessary.

And, I don't know how to shrink the pic on my labels, and not sacrfice some of the details for sake of size. Ideas?

Now, what remains is the problem of getting the art to work for you at various sizes. There are many possible solutions...but, considering what you said about requesting a redraw, and her delay in providing one..what are your best options?

Here are a few possibilities that come to my mind this morning:

1) Tell Jenny that you need a logo whose details can be seen and appreciated at a very small scale. I usually work at a original size no larger that 2x the final reproduction size for the sake of simplicity. And ask her to provide this in a reasonable amount of time.

2) Use Jenny's illustration as a starting point for a derivative artwork which has the changes you would like to see. This could be created by her or another artist of your choice. Now that you have identified the limitations of the original art, a new piece can created free of these problems.

3) A small detail from the existing illustration could easily be developed into a logo just as it is. (I mentioned this suggestion in my last post) This may not have all the elements you mentioned, but perhaps the amber fox detail image can work on it's own? I can show you what I am imaging more easily should we be lucky enough to meet in person at the seed swap this Saturday?

Yours truly,

Aline